Jerry Vines Blog
I was elected president of the SBC in 1988. Some half-jokingly said I was the first independent Baptist in history elected president! Actually, all my roots are in Southern Baptist life. I was saved, called to preach, educated, and served in only Southern Baptist churches.
In the earlier years several of us were so concerned about liberalism in the SBC we thought we might indeed become independents. Adrian Rogers and I talked about it frequently. Of course, you know the rest of the story. The Conservative Resurgence was successful in restoring the convention to its conservative roots.
However, properly understood, every Southern Baptist church, pastor and member is independent Baptist. Each local congregation is independent and autonomous. No association, state convention or national convention can dictate to the local church. Local churches can choose to do their own mission work.
Some churches I served sent their own missionaries as well as supported Southern Baptist mission work. I think of First Baptist Jacksonville’s support of Bob Tebow, father of Tim, who has an independent work in the Philippines. Many larger churches can do some things in ministry and missions that smaller ones cannot. God bless them.
But, through the years I have witnessed the work of the Southern Baptist Convention. Imperfect? Yes. Can it be improved? Certainly. Needs constant study and analysis for effectiveness? You betcha. But, I have come to the conviction that the adage is true: We can do more together than we can do separately.
For instance, just watch the way the Florida Baptist Convention organizes and mobilizes churches to help those suffering in Haiti. The result will be millions of dollars spent on human relief and ultimately, thousands of Haitians coming to know Christ as their Saviour.
It troubles me that some who seem to have little understanding of the SBC are so quick and hasty to criticize it without really recognizing its value and worth. This independent Baptist likes cooperation!
Tim G
January 15, 2010 @ 8:58 PMVines is one of my heroes! Well done!
David Fletcher
January 16, 2010 @ 11:59 AMBrother Jerry, I have also been a Southern Baptist all of my life and I too have thought that I might have to go Independent because of my conservative preaching. Now, I wonder will the conservatives ever lose their hold on the SBC. Independent might be the answer for some of us.I honesty have a deep respect for you. I was at the Convention when you became our President. That's when we began to make a turn for the better. I enjoy your blog. Keep it up!
Kathy C
January 16, 2010 @ 3:05 PMTruth be known, Southern Baptist are usually the first to arrive on the scene and the last to leave. Just sayin', I love the worker bees of the SBC and feelin' the need to lift them to the Father. They put themselves at incredible personal risk to minister the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Tim Rogers
January 18, 2010 @ 5:56 AMDr. Vines,
You are the most cooperative independent that I have ever run across. Thank you for your faithfulness.
Blessings,
Tim
Don Bickers
January 21, 2010 @ 12:31 PMDear Jerry,
Thank you so much for the example you set for all us "preacher boys" from West Rome Baptist Church throughout the many years since the late 60's. Regardless of all the places we have served as pastor and militray chaplain through NAMB, we have always be aware of your dedicated service to the SBC.
We still need to hear from those like you in our ever changing world.
May you and your family have a great 2010!!
Don and Pat Bickers
Tony Samples
January 26, 2010 @ 9:16 AMThank you so much for this article. You have hit the nail on the head. Whatever we can alone we definitely can do better together. May God continue to bless you and your ministry.
Bill Lykins
March 22, 2010 @ 1:40 PMLike the eminent Dr. Jerry Vines, who is not only a man of great integrity, but also a master at hermeneutics & homiletics, I grew up in the Southern Baptist way. Matter of fact, my 72 year old father, a Southern Baptist pastor, retired a few years ago. He has continued to serve as interim pastor at serval Southern Baptist churches since his retirement. When surrendering to God’s call to “preach the word,” I chose not to go the convention way. Nonetheless, I had the rare privilege of attending the John 3:16 conference with my father. I was blessed to learn some new information at that conference as we tiptoed through the TULIP’s. As an onlooker I see a great struggle for the soul of the SBC. A couple of SBC schools are pushing a strong Calvinsim, and conversely there are those who appear to think that General Baptists can cohabit with Particular Baptists - so to say. Perhaps I need to clarify that I am a “No Point Calvinist,” for there is not point in it. As I recall the John 3:16 conference there was an ex-Presbyterian young man in the Q & A who expressed disappointment in that NO positional statement came out of the meeting. I pastor an church in Northern Alabama and have at times wrestled with the question “Could I return to my spiritual roots?” I believe in the final hour of the John 3:16 conference Providence thundered in response to that query.
Here’s what occurred: When Richard Land made his closing comments the entire panel concurred which was evidenced by each man with the a nod of the head. The panel consisted of: Dr. Richard Land, Dr. David Allen, Dr. Steve Lemke, Dr Ken Keathley, Dr. Yarnell filled in for Dr. Paige Patterson. A question came from Dwight McKissic a pastor at Cornerstone Baptist Church in Arlington, Texas:
“There’s a friendly debate on my staff and that is uh if a person believes that they are saved uh by accepting Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour — and I like what Dr. Allen explained about faith and the process and response and what comes first — wasn’t that you Dr. Allen that did that — who ever I’ve heard so much preaching today — was that you — well you did it I really like that aspect — but uh I guess in the context of Obama Jeremiah Wright uh I believe in the inerrancy strongly I believe in salvation though Jesus Christ alone strongly — I think the Bible is crystal clear on both of those subjects actually — uh but I don’t believe that if a person does not believe — if they say they are saved by Jesus — Obama said that he accepted Jesus Christ, he was redeemed I believe he said, by the blood of Jesus on Rick Warren’s interview, but he believed there were other avenues to heaven — uh which I don’t believe that but I don’t it negates his salvation if he’s genuinely saved because he believed that there might be other avenues uh to heaven uh uh but I got folk on my staff who are more to the right than I am and uh they they really believe that if you don’t believe that salvation is not only just exclusively through Christ but that anybody who uh uh has an approach to salvation outside of Christ you are not saved if if you believe that there is another way outside of Christ — & to me that’s adding to the purity and simplicity of the gospel — when it becomes faith in Christ plus belief that everyone else has uh has to go through Christ — so my question is just simply to uh to respond & weigh in for me please on whether or not uh one is that is is a person saved if they say their saved through Jesus — they know the ABC’s of the gospel — they’ve uh done what takes to get saved like rest of us but yet they believe that the Buddhist the Mormon or the Muslim can be saved uh does that is that salvation negated because they believe there are other avenues to Christ that’s simply my question.”
An answer from Richard Land president of SBC’s Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission:
“Well I I I don’t know what that has to do with election but I’ll try to answer it but look we have we have um in our fallen sinful minds even as saved people what could be called compartmentalized attitude structures Um I can remember um when I was a boy I had a Sunday School teacher who was in many ways a godly man um he his name was Mr. Cook he was um a he was a mailman and he made certain that he had a conversation with every boy in his class every year to make certain whether or not they had accepted Jesus as their Saviour, Uh but he was uh a racist. And uh I was not taught racism at home. I was very fortunate I I never heard my parents talk in racial terms and when he he said some things that I was just shocked by and I went and told my mother and she told my father had a conversation with Mr. Cook that I I was not privy to but it it I think it I surfaced some stark differences. Um now I think Mr. Cook was saved he certainly gave evidence of it but he had an absolutely anti-biblical view of race. Um I think of Jimmy Carter I try not to but I continue to [much laughter]. Some of some of you will remember that Jimmy Carter when he ran for President the first time went all around the country saying I’m a born-again Christian I believe in the basic goodness of the American people. Well of course if you are consistent born-again Christian you don’t believe in the basic goodness of anybody. So he had a view of human nature that was in conflict with what the Bible teaches. Now of course when you are talking about salvation in something in something other than Christ you are really getting to a very serious disagreement and a very serious uh difference from Scripture. However, I have to say that I know people personally who I believe are Christians and who would tell you that you need to have you know they would they would share their faith with you who do believe that it is possible that that God in His mercy may provide some other way to heaven. Now, I think they are wrong. I think the Bible is crystal clear about this — but I guess I have go back to my default position which is Romans 10:9 ‘If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in thine heart that God hath raised Him from the dead thou shalt be saved.’ Now I guess we could get into a discussion about to confess the Lord Jesus but if if you believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is your Lord and Saviour that He is the virgin born Son of God that died on the cross having lived a sinless life was resurrected on Easter Sunday and has been has has ascended to the right hand of the Father and is coming back to judge the quick and the dead and you are trusting Him for salvation and you are confessing Him with your mouth then I believe you are saved whatever else you may believe that is totally wrong.”
That response caused no small stir within my spirit which persists to this day. Yet, I have missed the time and the place to Biblically challenge such politically-correct thinking. Again, as an onlooker there appears to be more tolerance for a false-gospel in the SBC than the Apostle Paul had as he penned his Epistle to the churches of Galatia. Anyone who believes Jesus is a way for them but not for others is lost! Jesus, Himself said, “I am the way ...” In the Garden He prayed to the Father, “if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.” How sad, in the John 3:16 conference, which should have been coagulated in the gospel, that very gospel was resoundingly compromised!
Some four years ago I had the privilege of preaching the funeral of my wife’s 94 year old grandmother. This was in Tennessee, and at the conclusion of that service a SBC pastor in his late 60's identified himself and then asked me if I was an Independent Baptist pastor. When I told him “Yes,” his words were, “I thought so - you have what we Southern Baptist preachers need.”
There is currently occurring a major epistemological shift in the churches of America and our nation needs the SBC to stay true doxologically and soteriologically to God’s call. Great men such as Adrian Rogers are not here, but the battle still rages! Where are the men who will pick up the mantle and stand with conviction, courage and compassion? Where are those who will speak from Heaven’s point of view alone! Oh how I wished I could have held to my roots, for it would have been a much easier road. But then again my conscience before God would not allow it. Yet, the SBC does allow autonomy, but to equate that to being Independent is disingenuous. No Independent would compromise the gospel of God. I understand that the SBC has made the choice to send physical aid to countries without including spiritual aid. No Independent would send physical aid to those who are suffering without including Gospel Tracts as well! May we all experience a revival of the old time religion which features the Book, the Blood, and the Blessed Hope!
Robert Ross
March 25, 2010 @ 11:53 PMNow I am on the other side. I was an Independent Baptist for many years. It took me a long time to begin attending an SBC church. I am so impressed by what we as a convention do for world missions, how staunchly conservative we are as a whole. Yes the IFB movement is very quick to pick apart the SBC. In hindsight I believe it can explained with one word. That word is Jealousy. Thank you brother Vines for what you do. God Bless.
Wade
April 20, 2010 @ 9:56 AMGreat post Dr. Vines! I hope and pray that more men like you will balance the proposals being made currently. As a young Baptist pastor, I entered the SBC world greatly because of a belief in the Cooperative Program. At the present moment, I have reservations that CP will endure the proposals of the GCR task force.